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Enter Wonder Woman

23 Apr 2022 13:30 - 23 Apr 2022 13:40 #73823 by Monty
Enter Wonder Woman was created by Monty
I haven't seen this before. She is very, VERY impressive here!


 
Last edit: 23 Apr 2022 13:40 by Monty.
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23 Apr 2022 14:10 #73825 by slim36
Replied by slim36 on topic Enter Wonder Woman
Big difference in versions. Lot of the impressive action is in the Zack Snyder version
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23 Apr 2022 17:20 #73830 by shadar
Replied by shadar on topic Enter Wonder Woman
Snyder does some action scenes VERY well... others, not so so much. Snyder's pacing and focus on what makes WW so super is really shown here. While others take details out of a scene, thinking they are unneccesary, Snyder maximizes them. 

I haven't gone back and compared this scene, moment by moment, with the original scene, maybe it's not all that different, but this feels more intimate and involved and detailed and much more satisfying in the tiniest details, at least to a genre geek like me. 

Another thought... imagine if we'd had this kind of special effects back in the Linda Carter era? Or, frankly, with Supergirl.

I usually prefer my own imagination and ability to dwell endlessly on minor but important details, but Snyder's cut of this scene is very impressive. 

Shadar
 
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23 Apr 2022 18:09 - 23 Apr 2022 18:34 #73834 by Monty
Replied by Monty on topic Enter Wonder Woman
I'm re-watching the end scene where the guy lowers his semi-automatic rifle and he can only muster an 'I don't believe it'.
Her brilliant response is unequivocal and cuts straight through to the overwhelming evidence;
"Believe It!"
Superb!
​​​​
 
Last edit: 23 Apr 2022 18:34 by Monty.

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23 Apr 2022 23:48 #73840 by Mcvee17
Replied by Mcvee17 on topic Enter Wonder Woman
Love that scene, but at the end did she need to smash the bracelets together and blow up the bank?

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24 Apr 2022 00:07 #73842 by Woodclaw
Replied by Woodclaw on topic Enter Wonder Woman

Love that scene, but at the end did she need to smash the bracelets together and blow up the bank?
Thank you, that's one of my biggest pet-peeves with the entire scene.
Up to that point Wonder Woman has demonstrated that she's fast enough to intercept bullets and take out several opponents in mere seconds, which makes those last moments completely incomprehensible to me. In spite of her aforementioned speed, she allowed this madman to drop the weapon's magazine, reload and recock the weapon before acting. Even if she didn't want to get closer for some reason (although the closer an obstacle is, the greater the "shadow cone" it creates), the man was well within reach of her lasso.
Instead, she uses one of her most powerful abilites (which I think she never used for the rest of the movie, but don't quote me on that). It was literally like using a bomb to kill a fly. Even if she was sure that the blast wave wasn't going to hit the people behind her... there was the issue of the debris falling down on the street and the pressure wave that would have likely blasted the eardrums of all the hostages.

The rest of the scene is great (once you get past the Snyder-filter), but that final blast was totally unnecessary.

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24 Apr 2022 00:50 #73843 by shadar
Replied by shadar on topic Enter Wonder Woman

Love that scene, but at the end did she need to smash the bracelets together and blow up the bank?
Thank you, that's one of my biggest pet-peeves with the entire scene.
Up to that point Wonder Woman has demonstrated that she's fast enough to intercept bullets and take out several opponents in mere seconds, which makes those last moments completely incomprehensible to me. In spite of her aforementioned speed, she allowed this madman to drop the weapon's magazine, reload and recock the weapon before acting. Even if she didn't want to get closer for some reason (although the closer an obstacle is, the greater the "shadow cone" it creates), the man was well within reach of her lasso.
Instead, she uses one of her most powerful abilites (which I think she never used for the rest of the movie, but don't quote me on that). It was literally like using a bomb to kill a fly. Even if she was sure that the blast wave wasn't going to hit the people behind her... there was the issue of the debris falling down on the street and the pressure wave that would have likely blasted the eardrums of all the hostages.

The rest of the scene is great (once you get past the Snyder-filter), but that final blast was totally unnecessary.
I so totally agree, Woodclaw. I've been bothered by the Bracelet Blast thing since the first movie, and in this setting and use, it was especially wrong -- on every level. It almost felt like someone forced it into the scene just to maximize her power, but not for any reason that made sense in the story. That's her equivalent of nuclear weapons. 

Shadar

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24 Apr 2022 02:25 #73844 by murdough
Replied by murdough on topic Enter Wonder Woman
I admit, I always found it amusing that the terrorist leader was played by Michael McElhatton, known to some as Roose Bolton from Game of Thrones. He gets stabbed to death by his own illegitimate son, and now gets vaporized by an Amazon demigoddess.

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24 Apr 2022 08:35 - 24 Apr 2022 12:42 #73846 by Monty
Replied by Monty on topic Enter Wonder Woman
Maybe she underestimated her own powers at the end scene. She was there to help and protect the innocent civilians behind her, and to stop the whole bank being blown to smithereens after her flight up and off above with the bomb package.
I'm sure the bank would be content to accept their insurance deal, instead of much worse scenarios occurring!
Last edit: 24 Apr 2022 12:42 by Monty.

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24 Apr 2022 20:35 #73849 by kikass2014
Replied by kikass2014 on topic Enter Wonder Woman
The Bracelet-Bomb is pure Snyder.  Snyder loves his destruction porn, so he had to blow up the building just for kicks.  Nothing to do with WW or her character.

The scene does play out better in Snyder's version, to a point.  WW is def more active, throwing ppl around, etc.  However, in showing that, it also, kind of, depicts her as some sort of mass murderer. If she really threw those ppl into the wall like she does, then they would be dead.

You could argue that that applies to ALL superhero films and/or comics.  But in relation to this specific scene, I think the trimming done in the Whedon version is to make less of a killer, and more like a hero.  Which is what she is.

Overall, the Snyder Cut of the whole film does play out a lot better then the mess that was released originally.  But that's not really saying much tbh.

Peace.

/K

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25 Apr 2022 00:50 #73850 by murdough
Replied by murdough on topic Enter Wonder Woman

The Bracelet-Bomb is pure Snyder.  Snyder loves his destruction porn, so he had to blow up the building just for kicks.  Nothing to do with WW or her character.

The scene does play out better in Snyder's version, to a point.  WW is def more active, throwing ppl around, etc.  However, in showing that, it also, kind of, depicts her as some sort of mass murderer. If she really threw those ppl into the wall like she does, then they would be dead.

You could argue that that applies to ALL superhero films and/or comics.  But in relation to this specific scene, I think the trimming done in the Whedon version is to make less of a killer, and more like a hero.  Which is what she is.

Overall, the Snyder Cut of the whole film does play out a lot better then the mess that was released originally.  But that's not really saying much tbh.

Peace.

/K
she's a warrior, pure and simple, and sometimes warriors kill. it certainly tracks with how she twisted Max Lord's head a full 180 in the comics back in '05 and started carrying a sword and shield on the regular starting in the '10s.

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25 Apr 2022 02:53 #73851 by shadar
Replied by shadar on topic Enter Wonder Woman

The Bracelet-Bomb is pure Snyder.  Snyder loves his destruction porn, so he had to blow up the building just for kicks.  Nothing to do with WW or her character.

The scene does play out better in Snyder's version, to a point.  WW is def more active, throwing ppl around, etc.  However, in showing that, it also, kind of, depicts her as some sort of mass murderer. If she really threw those ppl into the wall like she does, then they would be dead.

You could argue that that applies to ALL superhero films and/or comics.  But in relation to this specific scene, I think the trimming done in the Whedon version is to make less of a killer, and more like a hero.  Which is what she is.

Overall, the Snyder Cut of the whole film does play out a lot better then the mess that was released originally.  But that's not really saying much tbh.

Peace.

/K
she's a warrior, pure and simple, and sometimes warriors kill. it certainly tracks with how she twisted Max Lord's head a full 180 in the comics back in '05 and started carrying a sword and shield on the regular starting in the '10s.
The arrival of the sword in the comics made a very clear statement. That kind of long, heavy sword isn't a back scratcher. It's designed to cleave chunks from bodies or run them through. You can't play nicely during a fight with a battle sword. 

Probably the firearm equivalent of the Browning Automatic Rifle (BAR) in WWII. Heavy hitting and absolutely lethal. Not sure what a contemporary analogy would be. 

Shadar 

 

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25 Apr 2022 03:47 #73852 by Monty
Replied by Monty on topic Enter Wonder Woman

The Bracelet-Bomb is pure Snyder.  Snyder loves his destruction porn, so he had to blow up the building just for kicks.  Nothing to do with WW or her character.

The scene does play out better in Snyder's version, to a point.  WW is def more active, throwing ppl around, etc.  However, in showing that, it also, kind of, depicts her as some sort of mass murderer. If she really threw those ppl into the wall like she does, then they would be dead.

You could argue that that applies to ALL superhero films and/or comics.  But in relation to this specific scene, I think the trimming done in the Whedon version is to make less of a killer, and more like a hero.  Which is what she is.

Overall, the Snyder Cut of the whole film does play out a lot better then the mess that was released originally.  But that's not really saying much tbh.

Peace.

/K
she's a warrior, pure and simple, and sometimes warriors kill. it certainly tracks with how she twisted Max Lord's head a full 180 in the comics back in '05 and started carrying a sword and shield on the regular starting in the '10s.
The arrival of the sword in the comics made a very clear statement. That kind of long, heavy sword isn't a back scratcher. It's designed to cleave chunks from bodies or run them through. You can't play nicely during a fight with a battle sword. 

Probably the firearm equivalent of the Browning Automatic Rifle (BAR) in WWII. Heavy hitting and absolutely lethal. Not sure what a contemporary analogy would be. 

Shadar 
 
Yes, agreed, her sword would be the type of weapon that only she could easily lift, similar to Thor with his hammer.
She would sometimes place her sword on the ground for hand-to-hand combats;
 "Seriously?" she would say. "Are you ALL trying to pick up my sword? You haven't got a hope in hell!"
 

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25 Apr 2022 05:04 - 25 Apr 2022 12:07 #73853 by slim36
Replied by slim36 on topic Enter Wonder Woman
Had to watch the whole Snyder Cut.  That action scene opens the whole movie, one of the comments was that Snyder Cut was rated R.  
Was wondering if anyones done body and bullet or arrow count for Justice League vs Snyder Cut.   
Justice League body count 10?   from listofdeaths.fandom.com/wiki/DC_Movies
Snyder Count body count 146? from listofdeaths.fandom.com/wiki/DC_Movies

A detailed spolier/plot summary of Snyder Count www.denofgeek.com/movies/zack-snyder-jus...don-cut-differences/

The Wonder Woman bank scene is the best superwoman scene I can think of       An example of what you can do with a big studio budget for actors props and special effects.   Can look forward to something that can top that.

A list of DC movies www.insider.com/justice-league-dceu-movies-ranked-2017-11
Have not seen Birds of Prey.


 
Last edit: 25 Apr 2022 12:07 by slim36.

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25 Apr 2022 14:24 #73858 by kikass2014
Replied by kikass2014 on topic Enter Wonder Woman

she's a warrior, pure and simple, and sometimes warriors kill. it certainly tracks with how she twisted Max Lord's head a full 180 in the comics back in '05 and started carrying a sword and shield on the regular starting in the '10s.


Technically, she's an Amazonian Princess. But anyway, its not for me to say which version of Wonder Woman someone should like.

The Max Lord killing was, if I remember right, quite a controversial moment for her character.

And she didn't carry a sword and shield until George Perez retconned the character, along with the whole DC universe, in the Crisis on Infinite Earths event during the mid-80s.

Up until that point, all she had was her tiara, bracelets and lasso.

Personally, I prefer that version of the character.  But again, who am I to say which version is better or anyone should like.

I have no problems with Snyder scene tbh.  But this image of Wonder Woman as some sort of "warrior princess" is not what Marston originally envisioned.

Peace.

/K

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25 Apr 2022 16:00 #73859 by Monty
Replied by Monty on topic Enter Wonder Woman
I like both the portrayals of Diana, as Lynda Carter portrayed her (definitely, obviously), but also as a Princess of the Amazons and a Wonder Woman Warrior Queen.
I think the latter portrayal of her would be the most likely, given her background in growing up with a history of battling, in almost Olympic competitions and conquests on Paradise Island.

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