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Captain America was Captain Hydra the whole time

25 May 2016 22:33 #48076 by KarkClent

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25 May 2016 23:22 #48077 by Woodclaw
To be honest this is the comic book equivalent of a clickbait article. I think that the basic cavalier attitude of the authors in this regard is the worst thing "at least it makes people talk of the character" is no excuse for fucking up things this way.

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26 May 2016 01:34 #48080 by castor
Oh also hes no longer primarily a black character.

Wait were we going to get some shit for changing that back? oh. Does this cover that up and hide that issue ? Oh great.

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26 May 2016 02:10 #48081 by TwiceOnThursdays
Replied by TwiceOnThursdays on topic Captain America was Captain Hydra the whole time
I don't mind this post, but the story itself sort of bugs me.

The comic came out TODAY. You shouldn't run stories spoiling a TV Show/book/comic the day it comes out!

I have read the comic in question, it seems a bit too gimmicky to me. Also, the quotes from the story are "it really is him" (and the story backs it up with when he was turned).

And I claim it's too gimmicky as "why now?". There is NOTHING in the story that would make THIS the time he did something for Hydra. Unless we're told that the comics we read, those were the tales _after_ the fact, and we didn't really see what happened.

So it doesn't make a damn bit of sense to me with all the times he's foiled Hydra's plans when he could have just ... slacked off a bit and no one would have noticed. Unless the story can explain that, it's just shitty storytelling. Maybe they WILL address it, but I'd be surprised.

Warning: Spoiler! [ Click to expand ]

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26 May 2016 04:18 #48084 by jdrock24
It's just a gimmick to sell more books and will soon be reversed and forgotten. It is pretty stupid though.
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26 May 2016 10:26 #48086 by Markiehoe
Replied by Markiehoe on topic Captain America was Captain Hydra the whole time
I agree with JD.
This is just stupid.
Any good will they built in the movies is just thrown away now.
Imagine some Mom bringing her kid to a comics shop and this is the first issue they pick up.
Potential comic fan lost.
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26 May 2016 12:55 #48087 by brantley
What next: Superman is really Lex Luthor? Or Batman the Joker?

--Brantley

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26 May 2016 13:36 #48088 by Woodclaw

brantley wrote: What next: Superman is really Lex Luthor? Or Batman the Joker?

--Brantley


Well, the theory that Lex Luthor might be an ancestor to Superman has been around for a while.

Regarding the Joker, the apparent reveal of his identity has been deviously switced with the reveal that there are in fact three Jokers.

(formerly Anon, still Librarian)

"What is the point of having free will if one cannot occasionally spit in the eye of destiny?" ("Gentleman" John Marcone)

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26 May 2016 17:14 #48089 by shadar
The problem with comic book characters is that the run out of stories. Generations of writers, all squeezed into the same box, will always try to break out with outrageous ideas just to enjoy a breath of fresh air. Which destroys iconic characters.

Imagine of Star Wars had to tell the same story over and over. Oh, yeah, well, hopefully that was just Force.

At the very minimum, switch to telling the stories of their children and eventually grandchildren. While you can't fundamentally change the character of iconic characters (ala Captain America) without disappointing everyone, his daughter (for instance) could be very different, fresh and interesting.

This is the problem with the classic comics houses... they don't do generations very well.

If I ever get to define a topic for the writing workshop at SWM, its going to be: Tell a story about Superman's daughters.

Lots of room for creativity there. How many daughters at what ages? Twins? How have their powers manifested as they grew up? Who is/are the mother(s)? Which vintage of Superman is the father? Are they fully Kryptonian or half something else? Human, Amazon, Almerican (Maxima), etc. What are their abilities? Their morality, their temperaments, their plans and goals? Good, bad, or morally ambiguous? Rebellious or cooperative? Carrying on the tradition or defying it? Etc. Etc.Etc.

The idea of generational stories provides so much room for individual and interesting story telling that also comes with huge creative freedom (compared to working with variations of the original characters).

DC touches on this from time to time in alternate stories, but this should be their mainstream. Just as it is in real life.

Star Wars is working in this space, and if successful, it will keep their franchise alive for another generation. Who is Rey, who are her parents and what abilities has she inherited? And Kylo Ren, born the son of heroes of the Rebellion, but now taken by the Dark Side. But forever?

Shadar

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26 May 2016 17:23 #48090 by jdrock24
I think Marvel know they screwed up when their movie star is sending tweets questioning their decision:



While I do still think it is just a gimmick and will be retconned eventually, it was still a poor decision on the part of the editors.
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26 May 2016 17:44 #48091 by inactive
I guess Marvel were worried that there was a "stupidity gap" between them and DC and they'd better do something to close it, quick.

It's like our generation's "One More Day." Oh wait, that was ours as well....

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26 May 2016 17:56 - 26 May 2016 17:59 #48092 by brantley
One reason TV soap operas have nearly all died is that the showrunners trashed the characters, and turned the story lines into practically nothing but musical beds. The thing is, people can get that sort of thing from reality shows. But apparently there are enough comics fans willing to put up with the same sort of crap that DC and Marvel will keep doing it.

Speaking of Star Wars, as Shadar did, Abrams didn't have to rehash the old story. I always figured a third trilogy could deal with the equivalent of the period of Reconstruction after the Civil War -- trying to build new institutions instead of just destroying old ones. The discussion has been mostly about the new diversity of characters, and I'm all for that. But what about diversity in story lines?

--Brantley
Last edit: 26 May 2016 17:59 by brantley.

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26 May 2016 21:32 #48096 by Revan

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27 May 2016 15:26 #48107 by brantley
Here's something from today's New York Times about how the movies are treating this kind of thing:

www.nytimes.com/2016/05/27/business/disn...an-and-superman.html

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30 May 2016 03:13 - 30 May 2016 17:38 #48128 by brantley
I note that Nick Spencer is a liberal activist. Does that mean some conservative activist will ring in, "Make Captain America Great Again?"

I comment further in a link at The Bright Empire:

www.brightempire.com/Blog.htm

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Last edit: 30 May 2016 17:38 by brantley.

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