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Hierarchy and structure of the Updates section

02 Oct 2019 10:24 - 02 Oct 2019 10:28 #65160 by JonX
Hello!

I spoke with @fats a few months ago regarding a change in the forum hierarchy.

The following is a summary of how I feel that my posts (and others) on this board are not being treated equally with other content producers.

As a content producer, I used to post my updates to the following forum:

Other superwoman websites > Updates

When I posted there - along with Taurus, ProjectSuperwoman, Heather Effect, WickedCity, etc - the updates then used to appear on the homepage in the two tabs (latest and updates)

But now there is a new "Commercial" sub-topic inside Update:

Other superwoman websites > Updates > Commercial

This make sense to me because it separates out commercial content producers from non-commercial updates.

However, there are two problems:

1. Any posts inside the "Commercial" sub-topic are not appearing on the homepage inside those two tabs (Latest and Updates)

2. Not all 'commercial' websites are being treated equally.

If you go to Updates ( www.superwomenmania.com/index.php?option...y&catid=4&Itemid=195 ) section you'll see topics from:

Taurus
Heather Effect
Project Superwoman
FightGirlz2000
Heavenly Heroines
UltraCharged.com
ActionCostplay
KickAssKandy.com
TheSuperheroines.com

If you go to the Commercial section ( www.superwomenmania.com/index.php?option...catid=531&Itemid=195 ) you'll see topics from:

Bluestone
SuperGirlz2000
... and my websites

What I am trying to say is that there seems to be a two-tier system which I feel is unfair - Bluestone and Superheroines.net vs all other content producers.

It seems that either all commercial websites go in the 'Commercial' topic, or none at all.

I know how people on this forum feel about Bluestone, and by being lumped into a forum with just Bluestone and Supergirlz2000 I feel this is a signal that I have violated some code, or my content is not wanted anymore.

I guess, all I'm asking for is the same treatment as the other commercial websites. As the other content producers will tell you, it's hard enough as it is without being penalized.

A good solution to me seems like:

a) Move all content producer websites to the Commercial section
b) Have an additional tab on the homepage for "Commercial updates" or something

Thanks

PS - my SuperheroineStories.com website is not commercial and I wondered if it could be moved back into the normal Update topic - www.superwomenmania.com/index.php?option...&id=31480&Itemid=195
Last edit: 02 Oct 2019 10:28 by JonX. Reason: formatting

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02 Oct 2019 11:26 #65163 by five_red
Replied by five_red on topic Hierarchy and structure of the Updates section
I'm responsible for creating the Commercial forum, and ensuring its content doesn't appear in the front page updates. The choice was deliberate, based on complaints that some content producers don't engage in the forums other than to promote their own material. Specifically it was the frequency with which some content producers posted promotional updates that caused a problem, coupled with the fact that the nature of their content sometimes polarised the membership. So rather than restrict such material outright, my compromise was to segregate certain producers into a separate space that interested parties could read, but disinterested parties could ignore.

Like all compromises, it is imperfect. If someone can think of a better way of handling this, then I'm sure the admins would entertain ideas...


R5

Supergirl Pre-Crisis Chronology: www.superwomenmania.com/supergirltl/
Supergirl: the Life and Times of Kara Zor-El: maidofmight.wordpress.com/
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02 Oct 2019 16:03 #65166 by shadar
I strongly believe that postings promoting commercial sites should NEVER get into the front page updates. That’s for discussion by members and for discussing postings to Stories. 

People who are interested in Commercial stuff (anything behind a paywall) should go to the relevant Forum topic for Commercial sites and look for updates there.

There aren’t many active sites out there any more that are run by and for fans who want to share their thoughts and creativity freely. SWM is becoming a rare gem. 

As long as people who produce or buy commercial stuff have a forum to post notices on, it shouldn’t mix with the more important work of free sharing and open discussion. We all have stories inside our heads and SWM should remain focused on helping us freely share those.

My opinion anyway.

Shadar
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02 Oct 2019 16:23 #65167 by JonX
Hey R5,

Thanks for replying.

I didn't realize that there were complaints about my posts :(

So from your reply, my understanding is this, that (like Bluestone and Supergirlz2000):

a) I post too frequently?
b) I am not engaging enough with the posts?
c) the nature of my content is polarising?

I 100% understand that the content on the SuperheroinePeril.com website is not for this forum. And I stopped posting about it.

But I am curious as to how the content on Superheroines.net and TheFemaleFuture.com is polarising? This is a personal opinion of course, but
I would have thought that my content was exactly the type of content that we all love on this forum? No nudity, no peril. It's the same level and type of content that you find on Taurus, ProjectSuperwoman, Wicked City, etc?

And the SuperheroineStories.com website - This isn't a commercial website, and I can't see how it is polarising? Don't we all love stories of Supergirls?

At the moment it feels like a two-tier system, and I don't know why I've been placed in the bottom tier. 

# Post too frequently - At the absolute most I post once a week (like Taurus), and more like once a month (like ProjectSuperwoman)
# Not engaging enough - Sure, I can engage more
# Nature of my content is polarising - I'd say it was the same category as Taurus, PSW, Wicked, etc.

If it were up to me, I'd do the following:

1. Tell producers they must own one topic per website. No creating a separate post in the 'Updates' for each individual update - I did this today because I released a new movie featuring Danica as Supergirl that I felt a lot of people on this forum would love to know about.

2. Tell producers they can update their topic once a week - this would prevent Bluestone from updating daily (just so they can be seen at the top of the update list)

3. Put all content producers in the 'Updates' section, OR put them all in the Commerical section - one or the other. I get that people want to see updates on non-commercial websites, and because content producers publish semi-regularly, the non-commerical updates can be lost.

By putting my content into a segregated area is making me feel pretty unwelcome. I did not receive any warning that I was violating any rules. 

Anyhow, they're just my thoughts.

J

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02 Oct 2019 16:43 #65168 by JonX
Hey, I don't want to labour the issue, but I just looked at the Commercial section again and:

1. Bluestone is now locked - so the Commercial section really only contains my websites!! :D

2. In the Superheroines.net topic - all the links and images I posted are all non-peril and non-bad stuff. The worst is of a girl in a red bra.
http://www.superwomenmania.com/index.php?option=com_kunena&view=topic&catid=531&id=31001&Itemid=195

3. SuperheroinePhoto.com topic - no nudity, no peril. However, I take the point that the website does contain adult content
THIS CAN BE DELETED
http://www.superwomenmania.com/index.php?option=com_kunena&view=topic&catid=531&id=31474&Itemid=195

4. SuperheroinePxxx.xxx - At the time I create this topic I didn't realise that I wasn't able to post that type of content. And I apologised in the comments
THIS CAN BE DELETED
http://www.superwomenmania.com/index.php?option=com_kunena&view=topic&catid=531&id=31473&Itemid=195

5. SuperheroineStories.com - This is about a pet project website of mine that lists a bunch of short story chapters of mine. They're all free to view. No commercial element. There are other superheroine fiction websites out there? Maybe it could be moved from:
http://www.superwomenmania.com/index.php?option=com_kunena&view=topic&catid=531&id=31480&Itemid=195
to:
Forum  Stories, Writers and Artists  Showcase your work
http://www.superwomenmania.com/index.php?option=com_kunena&view=category&catid=44&Itemid=195

This would mean that I'd only be updating three topics:

a) Superheroines.net (at most once a week, like Taurus, etc and more likely longer) with strictly non-nude and non-peril content

b) TheFemaleFuture which is still in the normal Updates section

c) SuperheroineStories.com - at most once a week (more like once a month), in the "Showcase your work" section

You could then remove the 'Commercial' section because Bluestone is locked, and the last post on SuperGirlz2000 was in Jun.

To me, this feels fair, given that I have been producing content since the Steele days, and whilst I've not been producing as much recently, I am still active, and I feel I have contributed to this Superheroine world?

Thanks

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02 Oct 2019 17:52 #65170 by JonX
Hey Shadar,

>I strongly believe that postings promoting commercial sites should NEVER get into the front page updates. That’s for discussion by members and for discussing postings to Stories. 

Sure, I am not averse to that. As long as all the paywall creators are treated equally.

Maybe we could have a "Paid Content" section in the "Other Superwomen Websites" section, and maybe its own tab on the homepage?

i.e the "Other Superwomen Website" section would be:
Updates
Paid Content
Links
NSFW content
Patreon

And then on the homepage the forum tabs are:
Latest
Updates
Paid Content Updates

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02 Oct 2019 18:58 #65172 by shadar

JonX wrote: Hey Shadar,

>I strongly believe that postings promoting commercial sites should NEVER get into the front page updates. That’s for discussion by members and for discussing postings to Stories. 

Sure, I am not averse to that. As long as all the paywall creators are treated equally.

Maybe we could have a "Paid Content" section in the "Other Superwomen Websites" section, and maybe its own tab on the homepage?

i.e the "Other Superwomen Website" section would be:
Updates
Paid Content
Links
NSFW content
Patreon

And then on the homepage the forum tabs are:
Latest
Updates
Paid Content Updates


That sounds reasonable to me, JonX, but I'm just an Indian here, not a Chief. 

I have nothing against paywalled material -- plenty of people like it and it should have a proper place --  but I think SWM should focus most strongly on free, member-created; content and open expression of opinions given the generally civilized nature of SWM compared to many venues for commenting. We have a pretty neat and pretty rare setup here.  

I'm only opposed to mixing Commercial and Free (no paywall) member-created material in a limited-depth scrolling list of posts like Forum/Latest. 

Shadar

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02 Oct 2019 20:51 #65174 by JonX
Hey Shadar,

I agree. Having all the 'paywall' content in a single area where all content creators can post updates seems logical - especially if there was an additional tab on the homepage so that there were maybe just two:

Updates
Paid Content Updates

But like you, it's not my decision - my original concern is that it is only my websites that have been banished to this 'Commercial' section, whereas it seems all other paywall websites haven't :(

Jon

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03 Oct 2019 02:15 #65177 by bionicskillz
Replied by bionicskillz on topic Hierarchy and structure of the Updates section
Let's just get rid of the "commercial" sub forum. Put Jon back in "updates"  and also the locked Bluestone thread in there as well for record keeping sake.

I mean isn't every site we look at all commercial anyway? Updates is for sites that have super-womens that specialize in there style of amateur film makers which we love.

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