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Why WW Failed: By Joss Whedon

14 Sep 2012 18:58 - 14 Sep 2012 19:00 #28591 by lfan
Why WW Failed: By Joss Whedon was created by lfan
"Stolen" from Blastr :

Last year, David E. Kelley tried to revive Wonder Woman on TV. Unfortunately, his version never got past the pilot stage. Even though he's an award-winning writer, something about his vision didn't ring true.

The CW recently announced they're developing a pilot called Amazon, which may be Wonder Woman's return to grace. But why has it taken so long? While talking to CraveOnline, Joss Whedon spoke about Hollywood's Wonder Woman problem, and why he thinks Kelley's pilot didn't make the cut.

"I don't think that was a match. I just don't. I don't think that he needs to write about superheroes," Whedon said. "You need to need to write about superheroes to write about superheroes. If that's not in your vernacular, you may bring something new and interesting to it, but at the end of the day, if you don't have that burning desire to talk about these people who have these insane powers, then some other agenda is going to come forward and you might accidentally turn off the dark."

Could that have been the issue? Whedon is a fan of comics and strong female characters. He's also spent a fair amount of time in the superhero genre. Do you think that's where Kelley went wrong? From what we've heard of the pilot, it was very campy—and not in a good way. The costume looked cheap and the fight choreography was underwhelming.

Hopefully, The CW's Amazon can avoid those pitfalls.


Personally, I think he's dead on....it takes someone who "gets" superheroes to write them...AND respect their origins and mythos. Enough of this "reimagining" crap!!!

ElF
Last edit: 14 Sep 2012 19:00 by lfan.
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14 Sep 2012 19:03 #28592 by jnw550
Replied by jnw550 on topic Why WW Failed: By Joss Whedon
Werd.

Everyone wants to be a beast, until it's time to do what real beasts do.

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15 Sep 2012 04:29 #28605 by MisterK
Replied by MisterK on topic Why WW Failed: By Joss Whedon
Yeah. I think that is about the size of it. It was telling that when complaints started coming in about her being "wimpy" there was a scene hastily thrown in with her callously (and needlessly) killing someone. It showed little understanding of the character.
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17 Sep 2012 14:41 #28636 by jdrock24
Replied by jdrock24 on topic Why WW Failed: By Joss Whedon
I agree with everything the guy said except for one thing. The fight choreography was not "underwhelming". Her fight with that gang of muscle bound thugs was awesome up until the part where she killed that guy.

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17 Sep 2012 14:47 #28637 by lfan
Replied by lfan on topic Why WW Failed: By Joss Whedon
I agree, JD. I love the writer (from Blastr) didn't even SEE the pilot apparently before making judgment: "From what we've heard of the pilot...." He also never saw the "last costume" which I thought looked pretty darn good -- he just mentioned the long pants version that was plastered all over the wires and magazines.

I think people had the total lynch mob mentality the second a few reviewers hated it and already had passed judgment. OK, I get the fact that "WW doesn't kill" (personally, it didn't bother me that much), but in terms of a high-budget pilot, it wasn't THAT bad. Certainly better than some of the schlock that made the cut that season. Remember Pan-Am and the Playboy Club? Yeah, nobody else does either....

ElF

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17 Sep 2012 17:08 #28642 by Markiehoe
Replied by Markiehoe on topic Why WW Failed: By Joss Whedon
Thanks to an alert member of the forum I was able to see the pilot. The production values were good and it did have good action scenes. Adrienne did not stand a chance as Wonder Woman because the writing was so poor. She was depicted as an un likeable character and a needless killer. She kills one thug for no reason, with her strength and bracelets she was not in any danger from him and yet fails to kill Elizabeth Hurley's character.
Poor writing, inexcusable. I am glad they killed it early.

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17 Sep 2012 18:00 #28651 by Woodclaw
Replied by Woodclaw on topic Why WW Failed: By Joss Whedon

Markiehoe wrote: Thanks to an alert member of the forum I was able to see the pilot. The production values were good and it did have good action scenes. Adrienne did not stand a chance as Wonder Woman because the writing was so poor. She was depicted as an un likeable character and a needless killer. She kills one thug for no reason, with her strength and bracelets she was not in any danger from him and yet fails to kill Elizabeth Hurley's character.
Poor writing, inexcusable. I am glad they killed it early.


True on all the points, still I think that Adrienne Palicki was a good choice, as far as looks goes. But, I agree the writing was too involved and having a killing main character is not a good way to handle a show with a possible recurring villain.

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17 Sep 2012 19:28 #28657 by lfan
Replied by lfan on topic Why WW Failed: By Joss Whedon
Have no idea of his thought process in writing, but perhaps -- and this is the way I guess I saw it -- is that this version of WW looked like a much powered down version in the comics by Kelly. Just because she MAKES it look easy deflecting bullets, it takes skill and dexterity and reflexes which need to increase as she approaches. And he's firing a gun so of course she's in danger. It was hardly "no reason". While she could obviously have subdued him other ways, she's a warrior...it was hardly no reason...

This just goes to show again though the original point is that you need FANS of the characters to understand and write them. I think a lot of the problems with the dialog and script coulda been avoided with some basic knowledge AND RESPECT of the character and her background.

ElF

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21 Sep 2012 00:08 #28683 by nextglobalcrisis
Replied by nextglobalcrisis on topic Why WW Failed: By Joss Whedon
I watched the pilot on some dodgy quality rip. I thought Palicki was good, she looked tall and strong, particularly in civilian clothes oddly. I thought it was madness to have her kill a nobody in the pilot. Killing is something that heroes must wrestle with, it has to be an absolute last resort to save others and the kind of thing you leave for a season finale. Wonder Woman is close to invulnerable, in the show if she was under-powered at all it was more to do with budget, yet she kills some goon who is far weaker than she is. That told me that they didn't understand what they were dealing with. Although had the series gone ahead we'd have seen some enjoyable action sequences with a female in the lead role (in costume) I seriously doubt we'd have been treated to anything worthwhile plot-wise.
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22 Sep 2012 00:35 #28697 by Random321
Replied by Random321 on topic Why WW Failed: By Joss Whedon

lfan wrote: [Snip] It takes someone who "gets" superheroes to write them...AND respect their origins and mythos. Enough of this "reimagining" crap!!! ElF


Even then it's hard - so I agree there is probably no hope for the others...

Lot's of fun potential poorly executed out there... ..."Revolution" anyone? ~ what a shame.

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22 Sep 2012 02:23 #28698 by jnw550
Replied by jnw550 on topic Why WW Failed: By Joss Whedon

Anon wrote:

Markiehoe wrote: Thanks to an alert member of the forum I was able to see the pilot. The production values were good and it did have good action scenes. Adrienne did not stand a chance as Wonder Woman because the writing was so poor. She was depicted as an un likeable character and a needless killer. She kills one thug for no reason, with her strength and bracelets she was not in any danger from him and yet fails to kill Elizabeth Hurley's character.
Poor writing, inexcusable. I am glad they killed it early.


True on all the points, still I think that Adrienne Palicki was a good choice, as far as looks goes. But, I agree the writing was too involved and having a killing main character is not a good way to handle a show with a possible recurring villain.


I thought Palicki was perfect for the role. Tall, beautiful, strong, absolutely perfect. It would great to have her play the role in the rewrite.

Everyone wants to be a beast, until it's time to do what real beasts do.

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