LaPorte Caves

Nnnno Wwway! A ch20 already? Can't wait to read this!

circes_cup wrote: I just submitted Ch 17 and 18 for posting. Ch 17 is so short I decided to finish both chapters at once rather than post them one at a time.

For those of you that are following the posting schedule I shared a few weeks back, the fact that I am posting 18 now means that everything steps up by a week. Ch 19 should be ready by 3/17 and then we hit a hiatus after that.

Thanks to everyone who posted comments in the last week or so. As I mentioned earlier, the best way for me to participate in the dialogue -- to explain the unclear points and to show the direction of the story -- is simply to get another chapter up. So I may not be commenting much in the forum but I'm trilled that some people are reading the story so closely.

I'm curious how many people are still following this story after so many chapters and so much time. If you've been silent to date but want me to keep going, please say so loud and clear. Knowing the level of interest matters to me.

Hope you enjoy!

Speaking for myself, I'd like to thank you, Circes! I'm really enjoying reading this story, and I think it's pretty much the most character-driven and dramatic series I've read in the genre. Enough to make my first post on the forum, even. I find myself really caring about what happens to the characters, especially with Howard (and of course Julia!) As much as I thought he was a jerk in earlier chapters, I now find myself sympathizing with him. Actually, I started thinking about him in as an existential character; he's essentially trapped in a world where everything he knew and valued is destroyed. Even his hard won skills are essentially useless. Even his relationship with Julia, the bedrock of the series, has changed. How does he define his new life, how will he give meaning to himself and his relationships? The story keeps drawing me to John the Savage's situation in Adlous Huxley's "Brave New World." I agree with Au Goose in that she's showing him a terrifying lack of empathy. (it took me a while to read the whole thread and I feel like I'm enjoying a healthy debate in my college lit classes- and I was pre-med!) To wit: As she tries to heal him with her milk she sees he is in distress, yet she doesn't care, instead focusing on how it makes her feel. Plus, he tried to refuse the initial treatment. Speaking as a healthcare worker, that's assault, no two ways about it. Another one for the list, the 'obedience' gland. Howard kisses his free will goodbye, and he knows it. I Have No Mouth and I Must Scream, indeed.

Having said that, it makes me want to go back an reread the whole series to look for anything else I might have missed. Circes, I can't wait to see where the characters end up going. I haven't thought about literature and philosophy this hard since college, so thanks for bringing me back, at the very least. And like I said, I was a premed so I hated that sort of thing.

Disclaimer: It's about 1 AM for me and I've been on call for almost 48 hours. Please excuse any ramblings. Also, Hi, everyone!

It's exciting and frightening altogether how powerful those women are. At first it was fun, but now I can absolutely see, and sympathize, with his fear. The change in Julia is scary, frankly. However, from the safety of readership, it's also very sexy.

I was admittedly a little disappointed Julia didn't get to have more "fun" back on Earth, but the story can't be all about showing off powers and still be interesting. I get that.

As a reader, I feel like a prisoner. While reading I found myself trying reason and resource my way out of the same situation and every scenario I could think of ended with Julia, or any of the other girls, as an impossible and unamused obstacle.

This continues to be an excellently written story.

jnw550 wrote: It's exciting and frightening altogether how powerful those women are. At first it was fun, but now I can absolutely see, and sympathize, with his fear. The change in Julia is scary, frankly. However, from the safety of readership, it's also very sexy.

I was admittedly a little disappointed Julia didn't get to have more "fun" back on Earth, but the story can't be all about showing off powers and still be interesting. I get that.

As a reader, I feel like a prisoner. While reading I found myself trying reason and resource my way out of the same situation and every scenario I could think of ended with Julia, or any of the other girls, as an impossible and unamused obstacle.

This continues to be an excellently written story.

Thanks, jnw550! There may be other visits to Earth but the core of the story will always be in the other world. If you want an excellent Earth-based story, at risk of sounding like a broken record, you should check out Bitten by the Queen. It's down for some repair and maintenance right now but I can only imagine that it will be up again, somewhere on the internet, shortly.

On feeling like a prisoner, I'm glad, so to speak, that you feel that way (if 'glad' can every be used in that context!). As I've said before, this story will not be an exercise in sadism: there is more to it than that. But most stories go to a really dark place somewhere in their telling. We're in that place.

spacemonkey wrote:
Speaking for myself, I'd like to thank you, Circes! I'm really enjoying reading this story, and I think it's pretty much the most character-driven and dramatic series I've read in the genre. Enough to make my first post on the forum, even. I find myself really caring about what happens to the characters, especially with Howard (and of course Julia!) As much as I thought he was a jerk in earlier chapters, I now find myself sympathizing with him. Actually, I started thinking about him in as an existential character; he's essentially trapped in a world where everything he knew and valued is destroyed. Even his hard won skills are essentially useless. Even his relationship with Julia, the bedrock of the series, has changed. How does he define his new life, how will he give meaning to himself and his relationships? The story keeps drawing me to John the Savage's situation in Adlous Huxley's "Brave New World." I agree with Au Goose in that she's showing him a terrifying lack of empathy. (it took me a while to read the whole thread and I feel like I'm enjoying a healthy debate in my college lit classes- and I was pre-med!) To wit: As she tries to heal him with her milk she sees he is in distress, yet she doesn't care, instead focusing on how it makes her feel. Plus, he tried to refuse the initial treatment. Speaking as a healthcare worker, that's assault, no two ways about it. Another one for the list, the 'obedience' gland. Howard kisses his free will goodbye, and he knows it. I Have No Mouth and I Must Scream, indeed.

Having said that, it makes me want to go back an reread the whole series to look for anything else I might have missed. Circes, I can't wait to see where the characters end up going. I haven't thought about literature and philosophy this hard since college, so thanks for bringing me back, at the very least. And like I said, I was a premed so I hated that sort of thing.

Disclaimer: It's about 1 AM for me and I've been on call for almost 48 hours. Please excuse any ramblings. Also, Hi, everyone!

Thank you! Nothing makes me happier than to know that the story brought one more voice onto the forum. The analogy to Brave New World is very apt. This world an alternate reality that is warped but also functional in its own way. In fact, I suspect that the title 'Brave New World' comes from the last scene of The Tempest: a girl who lived her whole life surrounded by magical beings sees normal people for the first time and doesn't even recognize them. "What brave new world is this, with creatures such as these?" The surreal wold in which she lived prevented her from recognizing not only other humans, but also herself.

Welcome!

AuGoose wrote: I haven't been keeping up steadily (its kind of a site-wide thing for me right now), But I peeked in on chapter 20. Found the versatility of the Nourished's milk very entertaining.

--Reading the plaque again in growing horror, Harold realized his girlfriend's spectacular breasts now concealed a entire bio-warfare factory. Nourishment had turned Julia's whole body into a living weapon. If the mood took her, she could probably conquer an entire continent single handedly back home, seducing or killing her way to absolute power. There'd be no man who could stop her. And no one who even knew they should try. There' be no hint of what was coming. There was only one thing that kept the Nourished in check, and if the Diana Tree would grow on Earth even that would become a non-issue to the invaders...--

Thanks. Glad you find it entertaining. I wasn't planning on giving her continent-ending power. I think I've already scared myself enough

circes_cup wrote: On feeling like a prisoner, I'm glad, so to speak, that you feel that way (if 'glad' can every be used in that context!). As I've said before, this story will not be an exercise in sadism: there is more to it than that. But most stories go to a really dark place somewhere in their telling. We're in that place.

Dark indeed; I just hope that we all agree on what's so dark about it. And I'm dying to see how Julia and Howard find their way out of the darkness. You don't seem to have left them many outs.

First, I would like to say thank you, thank you, thank you Circes for continuing this great story!!! I have not made any comments since chapter 14. I have enjoyed the roll out of chapters 15 to 20.

With each chapter, the "Weald" becomes scarier and scarier for men. With the Yoga class and after class lesson, one realizes that unclaimed men live in an 'open season of hurt' from the Nourished, as they don't seem to have any laws that truly protect them. Even the Claimed can be brutally punished by their mistress. Then we see Julia demonstrate some Weald justice on Earth to Tony. It's not that he didn't deserve punishment, but she seems to enjoy it and finds it therapeutic. What would Howard think if he knew what she did? Of course Howard is still his stupid, stubborn self on the journey back through the cave and needs to be saved and healed by Julia. The one statement during the whole Cliff episode that hit me, was where Julia states that Howard really is pathetic, as she is bored with diving from such a low point on the cliff and his form is not perfect. Of course he pushes himself and once again Julia must heal him. This time she 'enhances' him a little more energy, slightly bigger muscles and bigger cock. So then he uses that energy to run far enough to visit the museum, where he finds out that holy shit am I screwed!!! The truth of the power of BOOBS is totally frightening, as it gives the Nourished total and complete control of men, all the way to death. And Julia has no qualms with forcing Howard to take a shot of Obedience, who knows what else she will do to Howard with her boob juice? Not sure what lays ahead, but Howard must be sitting out on the jet ski, wondering how to survive what has become a true nightmare of possibilities.

As much as I find the Nourished to be be my female dream physically, the Weald is not a place I would want to try to survive.

I think spacemonkey sums it up quite well:

[quote="spacemonkey" post=53229

Speaking for myself, I'd like to thank you, Circes! I'm really enjoying reading this story, and I think it's pretty much the most character-driven and dramatic series I've read in the genre. Enough to make my first post on the forum, even. I find myself really caring about what happens to the characters, especially with Howard (and of course Julia!) As much as I thought he was a jerk in earlier chapters, I now find myself sympathizing with him. Actually, I started thinking about him in as an existential character; he's essentially trapped in a world where everything he knew and valued is destroyed. Even his hard won skills are essentially useless. Even his relationship with Julia, the bedrock of the series, has changed. How does he define his new life, how will he give meaning to himself and his relationships? The story keeps drawing me to John the Savage's situation in Adlous Huxley's "Brave New World." I agree with Au Goose in that she's showing him a terrifying lack of empathy. (it took me a while to read the whole thread and I feel like I'm enjoying a healthy debate in my college lit classes- and I was pre-med!) To wit: As she tries to heal him with her milk she sees he is in distress, yet she doesn't care, instead focusing on how it makes her feel. Plus, he tried to refuse the initial treatment. Speaking as a healthcare worker, that's assault, no two ways about it. Another one for the list, the 'obedience' gland. Howard kisses his free will goodbye, and he knows it. I Have No Mouth and I Must Scream, indeed.

Having said that, it makes me want to go back an reread the whole series to look for anything else I might have missed. Circes, I can't wait to see where the characters end up going. I haven't thought about literature and philosophy this hard since college, so thanks for bringing me back, at the very least. And like I said, I was a premed so I hated that sort of thing.

Disclaimer: It's about 1 AM for me and I've been on call for almost 48 hours. Please excuse any ramblings. Also, Hi, everyone![/quote]

twitch99 wrote: The one statement during the whole Cliff episode that hit me, was where Julia states that Howard really is pathetic, as she is bored with diving from such a low point on the cliff and his form is not perfect.

There's a line in the most recent chapter that I think is very telling of the situation, and of Julia's current state of mind.

“Howard, I’m offended.” Julia’s eyes narrowed. “If I wanted to kill you, I could have done it any number of ways. I could have torn your arms off and let you drown. The eels would have found you before the police did. But if you think I would ever do that, then, well, we really don’t belong together in the first place.”

No, all she's done to Howard is squeeze him until he passed out, laugh at him, insult him, ridicule him, tie him up, ignore his pain, carry him around like a sack of potatoes, scare him until he pissed himself, force him to consume something that would override his thoughts and emotions, order him around, and now that she's made him completely dependent on her she explains the ways she could kill him and threatens to abandon him. But no, she'd never hurt him.

I still believe she can come back from this, but I'm waiting to see how.

I read the last chapter (20) differently with Julia mellowing out towards Howard and him having to accept his place here, even before Julia used her 'juices' to control him. I can see Circes taking his great work in a slightly different outlook, not necessarily in a totally new direction.

Just read the 20 chapter.
Great work as usual Circes, Can't wait for next chapter :-D (but don't rush things, take your time)

I've got Ch 21 and 22 in draft form. As you've seen in the past, I usually write chapters in clumps of 4-5 for the sake of coherency, and therefore need to get 2-3 more chapters done before these two can be posted in the story library.

However, I'd be happy to make 21--22 available on Google docs while I continue to fiddle with them. If you're interested in an early look, just PM me your email address using the PM system here on SWM. I already have email addresses for ElF, Lowerbase, Nickolai, and Twitch, so you guys are already on the list to get a link.

circes_cup wrote: I've got Ch 21 and 22 in draft form. As you've seen in the past, I usually write chapters in clumps of 4-5 for the sake of coherency, and therefore need to get 2-3 more chapters done before these two can be posted in the story library.

However, I'd be happy to make 21--22 available on Google docs while I continue to fiddle with them. If you're interested in an early look, just PM me your email address using the PM system here on SWM. I already have email addresses for ElF, Lowerbase, Nickolai, and Twitch, so you guys are already on the list to get a link.

That's a kind offer, and somewhat tempting. As much as I'm enjoying the story, I'm not sure if I want to see it before it's ready for prime time.

Pepper wrote:

circes_cup wrote: I've got Ch 21 and 22 in draft form. As you've seen in the past, I usually write chapters in clumps of 4-5 for the sake of coherency, and therefore need to get 2-3 more chapters done before these two can be posted in the story library.

However, I'd be happy to make 21--22 available on Google docs while I continue to fiddle with them. If you're interested in an early look, just PM me your email address using the PM system here on SWM. I already have email addresses for ElF, Lowerbase, Nickolai, and Twitch, so you guys are already on the list to get a link.

That's a kind offer, and somewhat tempting. As much as I'm enjoying the story, I'm not sure if I want to see it before it's ready for prime time.

That's a perfectly valid perspective, and I certainly don't take it as a lack of interest in the story. If you're interested, great. If not, the final version will indeed get published when ready.

Here's the latest posting schedule

Ch 21 - submitted for posting moments ago, will go up when and Admin can get to it
Ch 22 - Fri 4/21
Ch 23 - Fri 4/28
Ch 24 - Fri 5/5

For those of you that have access to my drafts, you'll see that 21 has moved out of the folder and a draft 24 has been moved in. If you don't have access to my draft folder and want to request it, just contact me by PM on this platform.

Thank you all for following the story and all your great feedback!

Chapter 21 is fantastic! Totally moves the story in a new and very welcome direction. Julia's newfound spine is exactly what she needed, and i can't wait to see where it takes her.

Woodclaw wrote: Chapter 21 it's a really interesting turning point, but it also highlight one interesting dycotomy in how Julia is currently handling herself. On one hand it's nice to see her finally playing her strength, not the ones given to her by the Nourishment, but those she has because of who she is and how her experience has shaped her so far. On the other her relationship seem to be getting closer and closer to the breaking point: Julia clearly means well and she want to help Howard somehow, but her approach so far has been so ham-fisted that it's kind of surprising seeing her understanding other people so well. I think that the biggest problem is that she hasn't really adjusted to the idea of having the upper hand on Howard so completely: with the people at Ruth's company she was able to empatize because she had been in their spot for most of her life, but with Howard she just can't find a balance point.

In my view, that's a great summary of the situation between those two people. Character-driven writing is new to me, and sometimes I wish I could articulate these people better. But if readers are coming away with the feelings and impressions that Woodclaw described above, then I'm happy.

Another great chapter. I was struck by the part where Julia studies psychology while she's preparing the tutoring program for Howard. I kinda wonder if the psychological knowledge of that world would be applicable to him, or whether anyone in the Weald would bother to study male psychology at all. My impression of that world has been that men aren't really expected to pursue their own happiness, but rather to view a woman's happiness as a higher goal than their own. To the extent that women study men, it would be how to get more out of them rather than to understand how they can feel better about themselves. Or, an alternate view is that men there are roughly equivalent to men here. But if that's the case, it casts that whole world in a different light. The way women treat men would be incredibly psychologically damaging; they have no privacy, no right to physical safety, and their bodies and minds can be hijacked any time a woman chooses. If the women there do understand male psychology, and still treat them the way they do, it's really quite monstrous.

Woodclaw wrote: Chapter 21 it's a really interesting turning point, but it also highlight one interesting dycotomy in how Julia is currently handling herself. On one hand it's nice to see her finally playing her strength, not the ones given to her by the Nourishment, but those she has because of who she is and how her experience has shaped her so far. On the other her relationship seem to be getting closer and closer to the breaking point: Julia clearly means well and she want to help Howard somehow, but her approach so far has been so ham-fisted that it's kind of surprising seeing her understanding other people so well. I think that the biggest problem is that she hasn't really adjusted to the idea of having the upper hand on Howard so completely: with the people at Ruth's company she was able to empatize because she had been in their spot for most of her life, but with Howard she just can't find a balance point.

I agree with you for the most part, but it seems like Julia and Howard have stepped back from the brink a little bit in this latest chapter. Julia seems to be finally trying to understand how Howard feels about things, and she has put some effort into giving him some tools to cope in that world. On the other hand, she still considers him feeble, has to stop herself from constantly correcting him, and thinks nothing of drugging him without his knowledge or consent.

This chapter switched back to Julia's point-of-view, so maybe her assessment of Howard's state of mind may not be the same as his own.

I did not expected this twist about Julia's behavior to howard, relationship seems going on good track. Now there is maybe a mindgame played by her even if she means well. If the video game project will be a sucess, Ruth may offer a job in company and that will cause a crisis in the couple. can't wait for more.

There's another passage from chapter 21 that is kind of nagging at me. From right at the beginning (Julia speaking first).

“Your skin has lost all of its color. And your mind seems somewhere else. What’s going on in that head of yours?”

“Not as much as what’s going on in yours.” He replied in the direction of the ceiling. “Everything I’m thinking, everything I’m capable of thinking, probably seems so trivial to you.”

“That’s not true honey.” Her heart ached to watch the machinations of his feeble brain. “What you think is very important to me.”

I kind of expected Howard to say something like "everything I'm thinking may have been put in my head by you."

Julia replies that what Howard thinks is important to her, but is it? It's just a few lines later that he says he's not in the mood to sleep, but she knocks him out and he sleeps anyway. Julia may tell herself that Howard's thoughts are important, but they aren't so important that she won't override them and replace them with other thoughts that she likes better.

Pepper wrote: There's another passage from chapter 21 that is kind of nagging at me. From right at the beginning (Julia speaking first).

“Your skin has lost all of its color. And your mind seems somewhere else. What’s going on in that head of yours?”

“Not as much as what’s going on in yours.” He replied in the direction of the ceiling. “Everything I’m thinking, everything I’m capable of thinking, probably seems so trivial to you.”

“That’s not true honey.” Her heart ached to watch the machinations of his feeble brain. “What you think is very important to me.”

I kind of expected Howard to say something like "everything I'm thinking may have been put in my head by you."

Julia replies that what Howard thinks is important to her, but is it? It's just a few lines later that he says he's not in the mood to sleep, but she knocks him out and he sleeps anyway. Julia may tell herself that Howard's thoughts are important, but they aren't so important that she won't override them and replace them with other thoughts that she likes better.

Thanks Pepper! Here's my take: We all like to think that we value our partner's thoughts, until those thoughts turn out to be at odds with our own. Julia suggests that she values Howards thoughts, but then Howard grows so despondent that it seems unhealthy, and Julia decides that mutual respect has to take a back seat to sleep and recovery. It's so easy for her to cross the line from hands-off to just fixing the problem herself..... or convincing herself she can fix it.

smoki07 wrote: I did not expected this twist about Julia's behavior to howard, relationship seems going on good track. Now there is maybe a mindgame played by her even if she means well. If the video game project will be a sucess, Ruth may offer a job in company and that will cause a crisis in the couple. can't wait for more.

grungykitten wrote: Chapter 21 is fantastic! Totally moves the story in a new and very welcome direction. Julia's newfound spine is exactly what she needed, and i can't wait to see where it takes her.

Thanks guys!!