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Supergirl 3x17

08 May 2018 04:32 - 08 May 2018 08:51 #59408 by theomach
Supergirl 3x17 was created by theomach
I really enjoyed this episde, a huge step up from last week's. Fight scenes were really well done. Reign absorbing Purity's and Pestilence's powers was unexpected. How are they going to handle her when she has the power of three Kryptoniians? I don't much care for James Olsen, and when he didn't open the vault, then lies makes me like him even less. The look on Lena's face kind of tells the truth about if she has more Kryptonite
Last edit: 08 May 2018 08:51 by theomach.
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08 May 2018 12:32 - 08 May 2018 12:33 #59413 by Markiehoe
Replied by Markiehoe on topic Supergirl 3x17
Supergirl in costume for the entire episode again!
As are many others on both sides.
Well done there.
Not that I don't mind seeing Kara in her street clothes but I am liking the embrace of the comic book aspects of the source material.
Of course Alex gets another version of the boring, black jumpsuit but hey we don't live in a perfect world.
However she did get an awesome new gun and some loosely explained magnetic powers

I liked this episode alot.
Lots of trust issues here that are NOT resolved by the end of the program.
Lena is eating up her screen time, I love it.

Type in on Google image search "The World Killers" and see how far down you have to go before you get this image.

The CW and the Supergirl TV producers have really dropped the ball marketing this show and all the super types they are showcasing.

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Last edit: 08 May 2018 12:33 by Markiehoe. Reason: spelling
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08 May 2018 13:34 #59414 by kikass2014
Replied by kikass2014 on topic Supergirl 3x17
Definitely a strong episode this week.

I, too, didn't expect Reign to absorb the other two world killers. Should set up a nice final battle :)

Like I've said before, Lena (and Sam) are by far the best on this show. And Lena proved it again in this episode. I just love the character and Mcgrath's performance (not to mention she is one lovely looking lady :P)

I enjoyed the ticking-clock narrative, which has been used many times before, but always lends an extra level of tension (even if the outcome is, ofc, forgone). Alex getting her "costume"? Meh, I don't really care enough tbh. Take it or leave it. I would say that the show should be cautious in some regards. The Flash (and Arrow), all, over time, made all the characters "superheroes". In a way, it kinda diluted the essence of the shows.

Supergirl's powers is what makes her special. If everyone has "powers", what differentiates her in the end? Her morals? But that is a topic for another discussion.

Overall, this is setting up a nice season finale. Sam in a emotional conflict, the stakes being her daughter. Can't wait to see how this will end :)

Peace.

/K
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10 May 2018 03:44 #59430 by TwiceOnThursdays
Replied by TwiceOnThursdays on topic Supergirl 3x17
I've been really enjoying seeing more of Melissa in costume. It's a simple thing but it does go a long way. I really do like her as Supergirl. It's the writing I don't like.

I can't say I liked this episode. Perhaps I'm over reacting. I mean I loved a lot of this episode, but things got stuck in my brain, and they won't let go, so I'm going to rant.

I'm a bit tired of her being weak/weakened/totally out classed. I don't mind the World Killers being stronger, but she shoudln't be so totally outclassed. If it were that alone, it'd not be too bad, but couple it with her being strained/loosing her powers (etc), it's just too much of a trope I don't like.

She's been weakened several times this year. She's already fighting an enemy more powerful than she is, no need to keep doing that.

For that matter the entire eclipse bugged me. Not the eclipse itself, they did the handwave "It's impossible but _Dark Magic_!". It was the fact that they said "No light, the temperature will drop 50 degrees right away!. Except we have this thing that happens every day. It's called "night", and there is a total lack of direct sunlight. NONE of the things that they said would happen happen at night. At least not immediately (they would happen over time).

Most importantly, Supergirl doesn't lose her powers 2 hours into the evening.

you can go back to the well of "it's DARK MAGIC!" and claim that it's effects were supernatural and thus quicker than normal, but then Brainy/Winn/Lena shouldn't be able to do anything, including estimate or guess it's effects. None of them have the skillset to figure out Dark Magic.

I mostly tried to ignore it, and label it "comic book physics", but they kept beating me over the head with it. sadly, it had no real story-effect either. It was just too much for no reason.

If you wanted Supergirl to be vulnerable in the "other space" it seems mostly mental so, just do it. Want her to be strained, go with the "she's the one anchoring them there and it's mentally/physically draining". No need to do the eclipse thing weakening her. (You can still do the eclipse if you want.)

Besides the DEO has solar lamps and solar grenades, why wouldn't you toss one at Supergirl and charge her back up (even if it's going to run out)? She should have been under solar lamps while she was lying on the table projecting....

Those little annoying things add up and distract from the episode.

OTH, the acting is pretty good. I manage to like this Brainy, even though I don't really want to. Odette is fantastic as Sam/Reign. The other Worldkillers are hitting their marks too. I thought the bro moment between J'onn and Mon-el was pretty good.

We do need to thin the heard a bit. We've got to many heroes floating around. Bring the focus back to Supergirl. Her name is on the marquee.

Also, while I like my heroes tarnished ... Supergirl was acting like a spoiled brat to Lena this episode and a horrible friend. Worse, she didn't seem to realize it, or come to grips with it. Instead she got all chipper when it was proven that Lena wasn't hiding anything (too bad it was a lie).

BUT, it's the worst kind of reaction. Lena now knows how fake Supergirl is. Supergirl didn't actually forgive her like she said, she spied on Lena, got intel (she thinks) and THEN forgave Lena, and then went and totally lied about it to her face. And now Lena knows this ... and Supergirl probably should have been smart enough to know that Lena would at least figure out that someone opened her vault, and figure it out. So .. lying to her like she did is just the worst thing she could do, esp after making a big deal about hiding things from her.

Also, uh, Lena ain't stupid. If she was an evil Luthor, she waited a bit before she told them she had Kryptonite. It was enough time for it to be moved out of her valut to another location. So .. .why search the vault and think the answer meant anything? Is Supergirl really that stupid? I guess she is as this episode doubles down on it.

Even Alex didn't get it. Alex FAILED. Lena found something she missed. Alex should have been trying to figure out why Lena was better than she was at something, rather than giving Lena shit. Why didn't Lena tell them? because the DEO had already proven themselves worthless. A little more humility from Alex, some admitting of fault, and saying "maybe we can work together and I can help you find the rest of the answer..." Instead, let's double down on the "how could you!"

I sure hope that Supergirl eventually has to come to grips with creating the monster she made .. and realize that it's ALL her fault. In fact at this point, I want Lena to make her own plans to stop the World Killers. Have it but up against the DEO, have them convinced that Lena's plan is going to ruin everything and their plan is the Path To Win, have Supergirl try to stop her, get tanked by Kryptonite, and then have Lena save the day, proving she was 100% correct and the DEO/Supergirl were WRONG. And then have them try to face the fact that they should have worked with Lena and not been so ego driven that they pushed her away.

Oh, and because of it, Lena becomes a villian because she sees Supergirl and the DEO as impedements to getting the job done. (The Job of Protecting Earth, and improving the life and safety of everyone.) Even better if initally the DEO/Supergirl STILL don't get it. "Well Sure, Lena's plan worked last time, but it was reckless! We are the heroes and she should have worked with us! She's out of control and we need to stop her!".

Hell, we just had a mind controlled Superman last season! Why would a good person possibly want a safe/secure stash of Kryptonite again?

Of course Supergirl just thinks that Lena had stockpiled Kryptonite, but it's so well hidden that no sensors could detect even a whiff of it. NO ONE knows it exists, so no one could steal it. well besides Lex, and it's unlikely he'd tell anyone. It's HIS, and he's not going to tell anyone about it. (or at least that's what Supergirl should think.)

So what's the WORST reaction Supergirl could do to being quietly told by Lena that she'd used Kryptonite. Run around shouting about it rooms with lots of people in it. She took a secret cache of undetectable Kryptonite and told A LOT of people about it.

I mean I know she's not a trained intelligence operative but honestly, this stuff is pretty basic and J'onn should have told her to keep her mouth shut and be careful about how she talks about it. That's just as bad as her prolonged, uncontrolled emotional outburst. Geez, the woman can't control her emotions. Aren't we past this shit?

Superman would ABSOLUTELY want someone to use Kryptonite on him if he was mind controlled and was about to kill someone. Or use Lex's device to put Kryptonite into the atmosphere if the Earth was attacked by Phantom Zone Kryptonians. I would hope that Supergirl would too. Neither of them trust the government, so i get why they'd want the DEO to get rid of theirs. But Supergirl said she trusted Lena and considered her a friend.

So if she thought Lena was her friend, she SHOULD have approached Lena having Kryptonite like Superman finding out Batman had Kryptonite Initally a but upset, but upon reflection going "good". Lena's canny enough to keep it safe, and trustworthy enough to only use it when needed. That is, unless like in this episode you have a snit and treat her like an enemy ... essentially driving her to being one. And of course, if you blab around to everyone that it exists.

This was the time for Supergirl to step up and tell Lena who she is (at the start of the episode, not when Lena asked her). "I understand why you kept secrets, I've been keeping one..." She had an opportunity to BE the Hero, a beacon for the light. Instead she wasn't. That she doesn't even consider doing that is part of the problem.

I like theomach's point picking on James about lying about the vault....though I'm going to stress that the problem was asking James to do it in the first place instead of going to Lena. And Supergirl lying to Lena about it is 100% as bad as James lying to her. Only ... Supergirl is the hero of the show, and we're seeing the moral ambiguity of James lie highlighted ... but the show just glossed over Supergirl doing the same thing. Not to mention how stupid it is to think an empty valut meant that there was no more kryptonite.

As I said, I really rooted for Lena this episode, and wanted her crush Supergirl, and save the day. That's not supposed to be how the show goes.

Later we can have Lena steal Supergirl's powers. But NOT give them to herself (exept maybe intially to get away .. so we get a few scenes with Lena w/ powers, reveling in them a bit, and it cementing Supergirl/DEO into thinking she's evil), Lena realizes it's dangerous to put that much power into one place w/o a balance. And the only balance to a bad Supergirl is HER. Instead,she finds someone else, someone good and true but also smart and effective. She gives THEM Supergirl's powers. Someone she knows will not always agree with her, but will alwasy listen and challange her when it's needed. i.e. Lena needs someone to balance her too.

Then we can have Supergirl actually ask the deep questions. The real questions, and work to become the hero she should be and earn her powers back. Or, maybe realize that the world is better place with her on the bench.

For bonus points, at first she goes and gets the rest of the gang (Arrow, Flash, etc) and they try to get her powers back and Power Girl spanks them.

Or, better, they can just start writing Supergirl that way NOW, and they can keep the name of the show "Supergirl" instead of having to change it to "Power Girl". I really do like Melissa as Supergirl, and it's a treat to see her walking around on screen in costume. And doing some strength feats. When was the last time she did one? I mean sheesh, do some Brainy/Supergirl humor of him struggling to move something and she just casually picks it up and puts it away. That plays to our crowd AND the target market and re-affirms our hero.
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10 May 2018 10:19 - 10 May 2018 10:20 #59434 by kikass2014
Replied by kikass2014 on topic Supergirl 3x17
Totally agree with your points Twice, even though I generally found the episode to be strong (mainly due to the performances of the actors).

The "eclipse" thing was also something that kinda jarred with me. I was like you, thinking "Wait, does Supergirl power down in the evenings?" But to be fair, and like you, I did the same, and said to myself its just comic book hand-waving. Which I'm generally fine with tbh (though in this case, it could have been more well thought out - your explanation actually makes more sense).

I think the point of the eclipse-thing was to add the ticking-clock element, but you could accomplish that with a different way like you said.

There is certainly inconsistency with her power level/powers which, at worst, is just lazy writing (which it probably is). I really wish they would sit down end of season and write a manifesto to themselves (the writers of the show), saying "This is what Kara can and can't do." and stick with it. I mean, this is basic storytelling. Figure out your main character.

Like you, I also found myself siding with Lena in this episode. Supergirl did come across as a spoiled brat towards Lena (though to be fair, I think Kara has always been suspicious of Lena, even though they have built up a friendship). She should have acted better, and also, more honorably (?) I mean, where do her morals stand now? Supergirl is the bastion of good, not a sneaky, go behind your back type person. If anything, I would have had Alex ask James to sneak into the vault.

Lastly, I love your idea for Lena next (and future) seasons :) Make it happen CW :D

Peace.

/K
Last edit: 10 May 2018 10:20 by kikass2014.
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10 May 2018 10:41 #59435 by Markiehoe
Replied by Markiehoe on topic Supergirl 3x17
I too see where Twice is coming from.

This is soap opera writing where not only do people act out of character they do not even act like people.

However the ship is generally going in the right direction and I am enjoying the ride this year.

Go Team Supergirl!

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10 May 2018 16:14 #59439 by TwiceOnThursdays
Replied by TwiceOnThursdays on topic Supergirl 3x17

Markiehoe wrote: I too see where Twice is coming from.

This is soap opera writing where not only do people act out of character they do not even act like people.

However the ship is generally going in the right direction and I am enjoying the ride this year.

Go Team Supergirl!


I have to agree with this. My frustration comes because they're close to being an actually great show. They have the right pieces. They just keep missing the mark. (I hear Don Knots saying "Missed it by THAT much.")

Here's something that just occurred to me.

Supergirl didn't want to kill Pestilence, and keeps trying to save Sam even though Reign is horribly deadly and the Worldkiller's have killed a LOT of people. She keeps pitching hope and trying to save them. She's tried to redeem multple bad guys, notably Livewire.

OTH, Lena has killed zero people. She's even saved the Earth from the Daxamite invasion, almost single handedly. (Didn't Winn help?)

So what does Supergirl do to her? Treats her with suspicision and doubt. Lena's done nothing to deserve that except have a last name. (Ok, she's done some shady things, but it's always been in the right path for the right reasons.)

But when it comes to Lena all Kara can do is focus on how betrayed she feels. I guess that's very human. And very soap opera.

When she finds out what James did, she's going to go ballistic and get self-rightous. And it's the worst look on her.

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10 May 2018 16:46 #59440 by shadar
Replied by shadar on topic Supergirl 3x17
3x17 is where I finally gave up on Season 3. Too much soap opera combined with really bad comicbook science and writing that belongs in the sixth grade. Sure, they get a piece right here and there, and some of the actors are talented, but this isn't the Supergirl I grew up with and she's not someone I really want to torture myself with watching further.

I'll sample the show at the beginning of Season 4 (assuming there is one) and see if the writing has changed.

But it is disappointing given the writing team has had some good moments, but whoever is in charge of the storyline now has lost their mind and gone full soap opera.

The only way to enjoy this show now is to root for Lena to embrace all her Luthorness and conquer all, and that's not a show I care to watch.

Shadar
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10 May 2018 19:23 #59443 by kikass2014
Replied by kikass2014 on topic Supergirl 3x17

the beginning of Season 4 (assuming there is one)


There will be. CW renewed all its Berlanti-verse shows.

but whoever is in charge of the storyline now has lost their mind and gone full soap opera.


I agree, and its not just this show. Arrow, and The Flash in particular, have really developed into soap opera schlock. Like I said a week or two ago, the big difference since the hiatus has been the departure of Kreisberg. Did he really have that much say in the storylines and writing? Or has something else changed?

If I am honest, I am with you Shadar. I think I might drop Supergirl from my watch list if it carries on like this. I'm seriously considering dropping Flash also (season 1 and 2 were great, but has seriously gone downhill since then - especially this season). Legends I might stick with since thats just goofball fun lol :D

It really depends on a) what their panels at Comic-con this year say; and b) the opening of the new seasons.

But yeah, seems a shame that the latter half of Supergirl has been so hit and miss lately, especially with such and amazing first half (arguably the best of its series).

Hopefully the last few episodes will convince me to stick around. Go Team Supergirl! I still have a little faith in you :)

Peace.

/K
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