Power of comments on stories

I received this question from another SWM author off-forum via email this morning, and it kind of rocked me back:

“Is it soul crushing to spend as much time as you do on your stories and get little or no feedback from the SWM community? The number of views is a kind of feedback, but nothing, in my opinion, is better than getting comments back from the readers.”

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I guess my initial response is that I long ago mostly gave up worrying about comments given I truly write my stories for my own enjoyment these days. Most of what I’ve written I haven’t even finished or published in the last five years because I get intrigued by something else and there is no draw from readers to focus my efforts. Having some distance to my readers lets me do whatever I want without feeling an obligation to finish anything. But once in a while I still give it a try.

But back in the 90’s, when I was running the AU, I lived for comments, but became so overwhelmed with them that they became a problem after a while. 

But I can’t deny that a few thoughtful comments would still be wonderful here on SWM.

But that no longer seems to be something that readers routinely do, less and less each year. Validation is very important, especially for newer writers.

Given the moderators pride themselves on featuring stories on SWM, I’ve decided to remind everyone how valuable comments are to many writers. Maybe there is a way to encourage that, to change the culture, but perhaps that’s what Discord is all about now, which I don’t participate in. Don't know if you do.

But the culture is not right on the SWM proper for encouraging or supporting writers, given meaningful comments are really the only kind of currency to reward most author’s efforts and to make all that work worthwhile. And to inspire new work. 

Your ‘soul crushing’ thought hit me hard. 

I’ve seen so many promising writers come along, full of excitement and bursting out all kinds of stories, and then disappear. I think lack of feedback and reader support is largely to blame, especially given there are many other places for them to post stories if feedback is important.

But those other non-specialized writing forums usually go down the path of trivial comments, in my observation. Most readers on writing-focused forums will acknowledgment a story, or say a few kind words because its part of the culture, or maybe a rare gentle criticism, but a thoughtful comment is absolutely golden and wonderful and incredibly motivating, but rare even there.  

If I hadn’t already been doing this for 30+ years, much of it during the ‘golden period’ of online fiction in this genre, when dialog with the authors was the norm, back when readers and authors shared a bond because there wasn’t a lot of material like this on the Net, then I’d probably feel very differently. 

I suppose a heavy involvement in social media and the changing nature of movie and TV shows has filled a void that we amateur or fan-fiction writers used to fill. 

But based on your email, you and likely others feel very differently and it's important to acknowledge that. 

Anyway, I’m going to post your email (anonymously) along with my thoughts on the Forum to see what others think.

The Forums on SWM are really good, and without the ugliness you see most other places, and SWM forum contributors are unusually knowledgable and well spoken and often enlightening. They are the bedrock of this genre. Be interesting what they think of this. 
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Shadar

I agree with your whole concept.
It may be worth the writer to encourage feedback by writing a column on the main forum to showcase their work and display their pride in their writing. This brings more interest, rather than posting it to the library and stepping back. 

Monty wrote:

I agree with your whole concept.
It may be worth the writer to encourage feedback by writing a column on the main forum to showcase their work and display their pride in their writing. This brings more interest, rather than posting it to the library and stepping back. 

I tend to do that given it lets me introduce a new story and make it easier for people to post comments. But those scroll off the on-screen list pretty fast when the forum is busy, so it doesn't work well. 

I think the basic mechanisms are present for comments in stories, although not ideal, but I suspect the lack of comments goes beyond the tools, 

It's kind of a cultural thing, I think. Question is, should that change or are most members cool with the way it is?

I'd like to hear what other authors beyond the one who sent me an email this morning. I'm the odd man out here given I've been doing this so long and I'm kind of a hermit in any case. 

Shadar

> but perhaps that’s what Discord is all about now, which I don’t participate in. Don't know if you do.
The SWM Discord isn't as active as it could be. I would say that actvity on it comes in waves, and currently there isn't happening a bunch at the moment.

But to comment on what you've said.
I'm kinda in the same boat as you, in regards to not caring, while at the same time also enjoying that rare genuine comment.
I'm hestitant to call myself a writer since I haven't done a bunch, and I wouldn't say that I'm skilled at this, but I've also acknowledged to myself that I'm not really writing for the sake of comments, or else I think I would have entirely lost the will to ever write again (especially given my lack of comments here, and on DA).

I don't know how to encourage people to leave comments. To me, the realization "Feedback are what writers live and die for" was the moment that made me realize that writers and readers need each other. One desire content, and one desire feedback, any at all really.

I'll be honest, this is why I barely write anymore. It destroyed any love for this genre. You put out work and views are nice but you never know if you're improving or not.

Also within two weeks you're generally forgotten about and the forum wants to go back to the Aurora Verse or the LaPorte caves. Not they these are bad stories at all but how can newer authors compete with a system where the lines are so skewed.

I used to have good ideas but I'm a husk of what I used to be, this is the soul destroying nature of what Shadars referring to. And no I didn't write the email, but I wholeheartedly agree with it

Woody

It could be worth writing 'shorts', stories or scenes to the forum board? I reckon I'm past the stage of writing a 10+ chapter story - it can kind of end up taking over your life sometimes!
I find it easier now to write short scenes to the board with any ideas that can either be appreciated or not. It also means more scope is available, and it can lead to contributions from other readers / writers.    

For sure i'm guilty not writing a comment on every story i read. Main reason is that i still can't write anything on touchscreen devices, guess i'm finally old
But sometimes i write something, and i'm sure there are some comments from me on this site, that are just not visible at all. Maybe a mod deleted them, but i can't think on any reason
This is visible with the links on the main page as well. If i click on the "Comments" Tab, i should be able to see the latest comments on the whole side? Lastest one for me is

I wish they could have extended the UltraWoman epi...
about 3 months ago

with the link on the "about 3 months ago" leading to www.superwomenmania.com/index.php/compon...=101#comment-44355,0
the story has just two comments (i'm sure this is one i commented back then), but none of these start with "I wish they...".

Maybe a "kudos" or "thumbs up" button would be a nice addition to the site. In combination with a short, maybe required, short comment box. Even if this wouldn't provide you writing guys with a long and detailed review, i'm sure there would be some twitter like short replies.

In some ways leaving a text comment just takes a bit more effort than just leaving a "like".   It would be nice to have a way to leave "likes" on different parts of the story but that might be somewhat intrusive like markups. It's slightly disturbing that comments are visible to site visitors without logging in.   Don't know if the website platform supports any other analytics that could offer feedback to authors.

My thoughts are mixed. For a time, I felt I needed to write for myself, and if others liked it, great!

I looked at it like, how many stories have I commented on? Even the ones i loved. So what makes me so entitled to receive comments? I always assume the overwhelming majority of this community is like me. These are fun stories, but at the end of the day, its just comic book smut.

DRU Marknew LFAN Concept of course Shadar....Without these authors, I'm not a writer in this community. But, i don't think i've ever commented on any individual story.

I find myself entering workshops more, and nothing is more incentivizing than when I learn a Titan is entering a WS. If i read that a Titan is entering a WS in the comments, im entering the ring, and I'm brining everything I got.

And while I don't expect comments, but rather appreciate every vote I get. I couldn't help but be flabbergasted at the comments I did receive on my last story. Its beyond encouraging and I wish every author experienced that.

From now on, ill do my part, if i read a great story especially from a new author. Ill make sure to drop my 2 cents.

The sad part is that I have commented on most of the stories I've read around here. I just haven't read very many, and most of those were for the story contests when I was more active here, 15ish years ago. You can find my comments in the voting threads for those contests.

d_k_c wrote:

My thoughts are mixed. For a time, I felt I needed to write for myself, and if others liked it, great!

I looked at it like, how many stories have I commented on? Even the ones i loved. So what makes me so entitled to receive comments? I always assume the overwhelming majority of this community is like me. These are fun stories, but at the end of the day, its just comic book smut.

DRU Marknew LFAN Concept of course Shadar....Without these authors, I'm not a writer in this community. But, i don't think i've ever commented on any individual story.

I find myself entering workshops more, and nothing is more incentivizing than when I learn a Titan is entering a WS. If i read that a Titan is entering a WS in the comments, im entering the ring, and I'm brining everything I got.

And while I don't expect comments, but rather appreciate every vote I get. I couldn't help but be flabbergasted at the comments I did receive on my last story. Its beyond encouraging and I wish every author experienced that.

From now on, ill do my part, if i read a great story especially from a new author. I'll hamake sure to drop my 2 cents.

That's a great point, d_k_c... if we all made a real effort to read and comment, then this issue of authors being demotivated by lack of feedback would improve dramatically. 

Like you, I'm resolving to get a lot better at that this year, because I've sucked at providing feedback as well. I get too wrapped up in my own stuff. 

During the roughly 20 years that I ran the Aurora Universe, I spent a huge amount of time encouraging new writers who wrote under the AU umbrella, but after largely letting go of that and just hanging out here on SWM, I've not felt the same ownership in promoting new writers -- or keeping older ones motivated. I've helped a few get started along the way, but my efforts have been piddling compared to what they were back on my own site. 

When I received the "soul crushing" email that stimulated my interest in starting this thread, I felt really badly regarding my own performance in that area. 

So I'll get much better in 2023. 

They key is that we readers essentially 'BUY' future and better stories by nourishing writers and their imagination by motivating them with our feedback. That can pay huge dividends. 

After all, this is just for fun, or as d_k_c says wisely, "it's just comic book smut". To which I would add, there is nothing 'just' about anything that you put dozens and dozens of hours into crafting. 

Shadar

The Mod team, and I are currently in agreement that we will take a look in this thread and see if there is anything that can be implemented to encourage more feedback from users.

Hopefully this discussion will help, and make a positive change moving forward.

It was interesting/disappointing to me that this last workshop was the first one I've seen where there was no general discussion of the stories on the forum thread at all.

That might be a bit on us (the workshop team) as we didn’t do as much as we could to talk about the workshop and get people excited for it.

DKC...."DRU Marknew LFAN Concept of course Shadar"


Yes, all true giants of SuperChick writing as well as yourself DKC.

This subject really resonates with me, as I am writing my first story and was really looking forward to posting it here. I'm still looking forward to it but this topic is making me question my expectations. I'm almost 40 pages in and considering how much time I'm putting into it, I'm hoping people here will really like it. And the confirmation of that fact should give me the energy to keep writing, to keep improving.

I hadn't thought about the fact that I might not get many comments. But it is quite possible and I have to expect it. Does this mean that my story is bad? Or badly written? Maybe it does, maybe it doesn't. Who knows.

I've read quite a few stories on this site and there are many that I've liked. Shame on me, I didn't leave comments for the authors. I should have. But why didn't I? Because I simply didn't take the time to do it. I think we're all very busy and it's not easy to find the time to write a review, even a short one.

I have a suggestion: why don't we have a scoring system that allows us to rate the story we've just read, quickly and simply, and that these ratings be sent directly to the author? We could evaluate different things: quality of writing, originality, coherence, length, desire to read more, etc. Maybe it would help with feedback?

To conclude, I think that authors should write for themselves first and foremost and find their pleasure in doing so. After thinking about it, I write because I love it. I enjoy it because I can make up anything I've ever wanted to see in a story like this.

But there will always be a small part of me that wishes the pleasure could be shared.

Fred9101 wrote:

This subject really resonates with me, as I am writing my first story and was really looking forward to posting it here. I'm still looking forward to it but this topic is making me question my expectations. I'm almost 40 pages in and considering how much time I'm putting into it, I'm hoping people here will really like it. And the confirmation of that fact should give me the energy to keep writing, to keep improving.

I hadn't thought about the fact that I might not get many comments. But it is quite possible and I have to expect it. Does this mean that my story is bad? Or badly written? Maybe it does, maybe it doesn't. Who knows.

I've read quite a few stories on this site and there are many that I've liked. Shame on me, I didn't leave comments for the authors. I should have. But why didn't I? Because I simply didn't take the time to do it. I think we're all very busy and it's not easy to find the time to write a review, even a short one.

I have a suggestion: why don't we have a scoring system that allows us to rate the story we've just read, quickly and simply, and that these ratings be sent directly to the author? We could evaluate different things: quality of writing, originality, coherence, length, desire to read more, etc. Maybe it would help with feedback?

To conclude, I think that authors should write for themselves first and foremost and find their pleasure in doing so. After thinking about it, I write because I love it. I enjoy it because I can make up anything I've ever wanted to see in a story like this.

But there will always be a small part of me that wishes the pleasure could be shared.

I like how you approach this, Fred. One suggestion... when you do publish your story, start a Forum thread to announce it so I'll know what to look for... and to introduce your story concept. Just a little blurb like the ones you see for books on Amazon that is your pitch to invest someone in reading it. 

Shadar

I absolutely agree with Shadar on this, Fred. If you have put the work in and invested the effort to write a good story, the next step is to mention it on the forum with a new thread.
All the very best on the writing!

I really don’t care much about comments. What I really like is the number of hits a story gets and that is more important to me. That and playing Senior Softball 4 times a week!